We want you to smell the coffee, realise what's happening and make amends: Supreme Court suo motu case concerning COVID-19 [LIVE UPDATES]

A Justice DY Chandrachud led Bench of the Supreme Court is hear the suo motu case registered by the top Court to check on pan-India issues arising out of the COVID-19 pandemic. Earlier, a two-judge Bench had formed a National Task Force to deal with the issues concerning oxygen supply, essential medicines distribution etc.. Live updates from the hearing today feature here. .SG Tushar Mehta: I wish as an officer of the court that if Supreme Court is considering the price structure of vaccines, it may hamper Justice Chandrachud: We are on the role of the Central govt.Justice Bhat: What is the rationale for dual policy? Centre is procuring certain amount and not willing to give it to states at some rate? SG: Its not dual.. Justice Bhat: we will not hamper your negotiations and you may call it dual.Justice Chandrachud: For the population above 45 years, procurement is by centre as of May 1. for below 45, 50 percent to states is by manufacturers on pro rata basis. The price is determined by Centre..Justice Chandrachud: The rest 50 percent is for private hospitals. What is the basis for centre to say that for 45 and above we will supply and procure vaccines free of charge and for below 45 states will have logistical arrangements..Justice Chandrachud: Centre has been telling us situation is dynamic and evolving. In the second wave it was the pre 45 which suffered a great deal..Justice Chandrachud: In this case if purpose is to procure vaccines then why should centre confine itself to only post 45 and leave pre 45 entirely to state for arranging logistics. How do we look at the marginalised and economically weaker ones?.Justice Chandrachud: for the post 45, supplying of vaccines to states is from Centre. But from pre 45 states has to make own arrangements How do you justify this. Now we come to pricing issue...Justice Chandrachud: Centre says it gets a low pricing since it buys in bulk. If this is the rationale then why do states have ti higher price. There needs to be one price for the vaccines across the nation. Pandemic has evolved in last two months.Justice Chandrachud: What about the digital divide. For rural areas you have said villagers can register on CoWin app through NGOs. Our law clerks and secretaries have tried to register on cowin app so we know how it works.Justice Chandrachud: From 18 to 45 there may be disabled etc, then why don't we have them included SG: in these two weeks, most of the concerns expressed by the bench has been taken care of .Please wait for my affidavit..Justice Chandrachud: Are you saying that Centre will take the supply and distribution of vaccines for the age group of 18 to 45. SG: I don't have administrative experience. Centre had negotiated and there is a uniform price for all states. i will justify the pricing in my reply.Justice Bhat: There are conflicting claims by manufacturers. There is no one price for all states. Distribution for states will also be now through proportion. Why there should be two prices. You collect it or else seek refund from states.Justice Chandrachud: We will see that we don't enter the area of policy.. SG Mehta: To make vaccination fast, sometimes interventions ar made orally in most bonafide manner. Justice Chandrachud: For the 45 plus group, how the logistics actually work out? give us a broad idea.Justice Chandrachud: If some vials have to be picked up from Bharat Biotech then how does that happen SG: May be your lordships have a better idea Justice Bhat: no solicitor we are not saying that SG: I was saying positively Justice Chandrachud: just tell us how it works.Justice Bhat: You have already said that its via Central Drug Laboratory and states pick it up from there. It is there in your affidavit SG: I have nothing to hide Justice Chandrachud: Let us hear the amicus SG: That may not be needed. they are not aware of recent development.SG: Individual house to house vaccination was not possible but we are doing it through RWA and with ambulance present Justice Chandrachud: but COWIN is still mandatory SG: If I am a villager and I don't have a mobile then I can go to a centre and get registered.Justice Chandrachud: Is this practical? policy makers must keep an ear to the ground. Look at the poor agricultural labour from Jharkhand who went to Rajasthan, he has to go to a centre there? SG: We need two doses, so if I get a single dose, then the person needs to be traced.Justice Chandrachud: How are you answering the digital divide? How are you ensuring that the migrant workers are able to get vaccinated? SG: please have a look at my affidavit..Justice Chandrachud: Please smell the coffee. If we had to do we would have done so 15 days ago. But we want you to smell the coffee and realise what's happening in the country and make the necessary amendments..SG Mehta: Please have a look at my May 9 affidavit. please don't take it as the final version. Regarding providing modes other than digital, COWIN digital portal allows the registration of 4 persons. These gram panchayats have centres to have infrastructure for internet.SG: Citizens who don't have access to internet can also take help from friends and relatives. Online registration decision has been taken since vaccines are not unlimited and if walk in is allowed then there will be crowding. But now walk in is allowed..Justice Chandrachud: So walk-in registration is allowed now? SG: Yes I was told so yesterday subject to the availability of vaccines .SG Mehta: There is constraint of human and infrastructural resources. It is therefore considered prudent not to permit walk-in registration. Now 45 plus people are less and hence there is less crowding now. .Justice Chandrachud: We are not going to say that we have a better policy in mind. There is an April 30 order pointing out flaws. Policymakers must have some flexibility. Our arms are strong enough to come down if we see there is non-compliance SG: I bow down.Justice Chandrachud: Digital literacy is far flung in India. There is no digital literacy even today in rural areas. I am the chairperson of the e-committee and we see how it is SG: It is flexible now and we have now permitted work place vaccination..Justice Chandrachud: Give us the policy document of the Government of India. As a legally trained mind we are trained to see documents. Rather than affidavit just saying the situating is dynamic etc etc.SG: If walk-in vaccination is allowed then there will be over crowding and then there will be waiting for peopleJustice Chandrachud: is it walk in for 45 plus across the country? SG: Yes.Amicus Jaideep Gupta: There is no change in policy. walk in was always there for 45 plus. For 18 plus cowin registration is mandatory Justice Bhat: I am getting distress calls from all over like Kochi, Bangalore etc. within 2 minutes slots are booked..Justice Chandrachud: We will give 10 minutes to each of the amicus to speak in an unrestrained manner so that the SG can answer Amicus Jaideep Gupta: Allow me to speak please. Everything is happening since some lacunae has been brought on record..Justice Chandrachud: Let the amicus speak so that you can take note of it Jaideep Gupta: The pandemic is slightly under control. Laudatory decisions have been taken by the Centre and decisions have been taken as and when they come up. GST issues have been referred to GST Council.Gupta: All GST applications may not have to be dealt with now. Regarding oxygen supply case since it was told to us by the registry that document will be filed in the Rakesh Malhotra matter and not this suo motu case SG: I will personally give this to you .Gupta: Oxygen supply matter can remain before the task force. The demand too has come down from 9000 MT to 5000 MT. May 6 order states that task force can go into areas of medical facility, drugs. Their response will be useful and hence please look into this.Gupta: For the present hearing purpose is to achieve vaccination in shortest period of time. Scientist M Vidyasagar who is in a government committee, he says if there is 100 cr of vaccines by end of January 2022 then most of the population is covered..Gupta: Anti bodies are there for 6 moths. So if the pandemic is not controlled within 6 months then the virus can mutate and vaccinate as quickly as possibly as early by December and latest by January. Centre has said all will be vaccinated by December.Gupta: On the new vaccine policy, it is not correct to say that if there is anything any incorrect in policy document then it is said leave it to centre. nobody will know then that a problem has arisen and is being addressed .Gupta: It has been stated that vaccine makers are not being receptive to the states. This is because of the policy. Foreign makers when approached has flatly refused as they just want to deal with Centre. Next decentralisation means states have to procure.Gupta: Even for present pandemic and above 45, the previous policy is applicable where Centre will procure vaccines. But for 18 plus different states have different economic capacity to lift vaccines so Maharashtra may lift more and nagaland may lift less.Gupta: Centre should procure for everybody since ultimately taxpayer will pay for it. There is no reason why the total rate for the whole country should not be the lowest..Gupta: To say that you pay for vaccines will not work. SG: All states have taken a decision for free vaccination.Gupta: We cant go by what joint secretary say. States are crumbling and if we have to go by it then all states should file an affidavit saying free vaccines will be given. Only then citizens will have an enforceable right.Justice Rao: has any state said they will not give it free and charge? Gupta: No they have not. but states have filed applications seeking a policy where central government should procure the vaccines .Gupta: Initially on the policy document, the allocation between states was not cited. Thus there was a feeling that there would be competition between states and private entities. Now it has been stated that it will distributed pro rata.Gupta: Let us say West Bengal has 100 persons and Nagaland has 10 persons then there will be pro rata distribution from manufacturers. But this only on affidavit. Then it has been stated by ministers that centre will not intervene in the policy by states .Justice Rao: On the aspect that distribution should be on the basis of co morbidities etc. I keep reading that scientific way would be to identify the vulnerable group in 18 to 45. don't you think Centre should include this in policy?.Gupta: One is vulnerable section, and another group is that persons who are on crematoriums are not treated as frontline worker SG Mehta: I can place an affidavit. They are being treated as frontline worker.Gupta: Teachers in 18 to 45 are too vulnerable. Not from health point but the work they do Justice Bhat: Even caregivers.. Gupta: Many elderly have fallen ill not because they went out but because their care giver contracted COVID-19 .Gupta: Something more sophisticated will have to be done than the cowin app.Gupta: It is stated that centre can redistribute a part of the 50 percent vaccines got from 45 plus category to states if there is excess. But there is no single principle laid on board for this SG: This is factually wrong. Gupta: I am only raising the problem.SG: Only two States have experienced. Gupta: The policy document doesn’t say how they will distribute or redistribute. No State should be able to come up and say this. SG: Second part may not be possible..Gupta: All the problem that we are facing is post-May 1. Till then COWIN was not a problem. 18 to 44 year should not have a different vaccination experience than the 45 plus ones. We are not going into the constitutional question as of now.Gupta: Even if we add Sputnik, the total vaccines will be 15 crores per month. This capacity is not enough to meet the six month target and needs to be expanded. Persons who said it will be done by December, some vaccines were relied on which are still being developed.SG: There is no such non approved vaccines government is relying on Gupta: A very senior officer who comes on TV regularly said this SG: Please wait for my affidavit.Amicus Gupta: Regarding differential pricing, it should not be done. It does matter to the citizen as its the tax payer money since centre can procure the same for 150. Manufacturers are selling it at much lower price abroad than in India..Gupta: Though Centre has negotiated with manufacturers and they may have lowered the rate but on paper there is no reduction yet .Amicus Meenakshi Arora: By the present policy, in states hand it will be only 25 percent out of the 50 percent and other will go to private hospitals.Amicus Arora: Ones who have registered on COWIN, they are not getting calls from medical dispensary but private medical hospital is calling and asking if they want vaccination for Rs 900. 4000 for a family of 4 is a lot of cost. Why should there be this differentiation?.Senior Advocate Arora: Central government has the responsibility to procure and providing the vaccines. Centre must lay the policy before the court to show why this differential aspect is being followed? Justice Bhat: 900 is what manufacturers charge. They can charge more..Justice Bhat: Like there is an advisory for the Government units, there needs to be a cap for the private hospitals Justice Rao: There is difference of charge between vaccines manufacturers too. COVISHIELD is 900 and COVAXIN is 1200.Arora: Under the Concurrent list, it’s the duty of the Centre. I’m only putting this because this will be in the central domain. Entry 81 in list 1 for inter state migration and quarantine. Justice Bhat: Essential drugs will fall in Central list..Arora: Centre must respond to this that why should it change a long standing policy which we have had since Independence, whether it was cholera, small pox etc. Justice Rao: How can we pin down government for old policy? Justice Bhat: No policy is carved in stone.Justice Chandrachud: Policy will be tested on the touchstone of reasonableness. it has to be seen it is not violative of Right to life. You can say that it affects right to life, that is by affecting right to health..Amicus Arora: Experts have stated this virus is stronger than last time and affects the immune system. Last time when masks were not available, gamchha, dupatta was advised. Now its no more effective. We don't know if we need a three, 4 layer mask or N95 mask.Amicus Arora: The rural population often depends on simple cloth masks and reuse it till its like wearing no mask altogether. There needs to be free distribution of free good quality masks. The national task force can give guidelines for the masks to be be worn now.Arora: Citizens must have guidelines on masking. Centre must take the burden of supplying free masks. Regarding crematoriums we have seen of late there is no dignity in death. There are many crematoriums which are not working across the country.SG Mehta: There is a suo motu case regarding dignified handling of the dead.. Amicus: That may be so, the poor are unable to dispose off the dead. Why cannot state give a ritual semblance to the disposal of the dead Justice Rao: Yesterday we saw that dead bodies were in river.Justice DY Chandrachud: A news report yesterday showed that dead bodies were being thrown in the river. I don't know if a sedition case has been filed against the news channel yet or not..Justice Rao: Ground reality is very clear. 75 percent vaccination is in urban areas. this concern needs to be addressed Justice Chandrachud: 25 percent vaccines to Private hospitals are to them who are not at all in rural areas. so this 25 percent is for urban areas.Justice Chandrachud: Right now the policy is such that it is completely exclusionary of the rural areas SG: We are not oblivious to this. We are taking daily steps Justice Chandrachud: In absence of guidelines there will be ad hoc decisions..Justice Chandrachud: Let the policy be amended. Let the affidavit not be filed by a joint secretary. You have to have a policy which takes care of new issues so that states are guided SG Mehta: The affidavit will be by the additional secretary.Justice Chandrachud: That makes no difference SG: we have troubled your lordship.. Justice Chandrachud: My health is not before the interest of the nation. But let the policy be open to changes. SG: There is no cast in stone policy as its a dynamic situation..Justice Chandrachud: If we agree to something wrong, then it is not a sign of weakness but strength. Purpose of the hearing has been dialogical. We are not going to lay down policy and engage stakeholders in a dialogue..Justice Chandrachud: We want to make sure that arms of the nation is strengthened. The fact that MEA travelled to USA and spoke to stakeholders shows how serious you are SG: PM Modi before this had spoken to all the heads of the nation..Justice Bhat: whatever affidavit you are filing, please place the policy document before the court and also the thinking that went behind the policy. SG: I will respond to all points if something can be done, we will not be averse to it.Senior Advocate Vikas Singh: SCBA has conducted vaccination for both age groups. For 45 plus it has been smooth. For 18 to 45, I must compliment the Union Health Secretary to supply us, but we wanted it at Rs 150, but we were given at Rs 600. This is private rate.Singh: Whether its state or central, the payment comes from the public exchequer. The Affidavit says that the different policy is not an issue because every State is willing to pay. That is not an answer.Singh: Whether if the State is paying for vaccine, 3500 crore is the budget for Centre for vaccinating the people. If it’s actually done then they can vaccinate 116 crores people which is a lot.Adv J Sai Deepak: One voluntary license has been issued already. We seek permission to submit it to the amicus Justice Chandrachud: You can. We have heard amicus, Solicitor General, and others. We will pass a short order today .SG Mehta: We are facing a crisis and competing on the national level Justice Chandrachud: We will not pass any order which impede the negotiations or welfare of the nation. .Justice Chandrachud: We will give you (Centre) two weeks time to file the affidavit. .Amicus Jaideep Gupta mentions certain applications: Students need to be vaccinated. The ones who would want to travel abroad Justice Chandrachud: (to SG) please look into it SG Mehta: Yes we will, only a phone call is needed.Justice Rao: We have received a letter petition for the vaccination to be given to leprosy patients. SG Mehta: we will have the letter delivered to us and the amicus and look into it.Dr Ashwani Kumar, Former law minister: When the first shot is given, the certificate for the same needs to be uploaded so that the person gets a second dose even if the slip is misplaced SG: You could have just told me Dr Kumar: I am making a submission in principle.Justice Chandrachud: Please serve the petition to the Solicitor General. He will resolve it. Its an administrative issue Dr Kumar: Next point is dignity in death Justice Rao: Amicus has argued it already Dr Kumar: I am only lending my voice.Dr Kumar: Operating the electric crematoriums is of utmost importance. Justice Rao: There are 150 people waiting, we have to hear all of them. Please look at the time constraint. Dr Kumar: Please give me 30 seconds.Dr Kumar: The vaccination drive needs to be also there in the elderly homes owing to their vulnerability. Next is to curb the super spreading events which is continuing even today.Justice Chandrachud: We have noted it

We want you to smell the coffee, realise what's happening and make amends: Supreme Court suo motu case concerning COVID-19 [LIVE UPDATES]

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